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Jan 22, 2015 4:59:32 GMT -5
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lincoln likes this
Post by wrightwoodwork on Jan 22, 2015 4:59:32 GMT -5
This question probably doesn't belong here but I'll ask anyway. If you use the pin on the DD what is set back to the first hole? John I'd assume 32mm? It also comes with detachable stops, for different set backs. Watched this vid yesterday, pretty good overview - Just had a look the step back size from the pin on the machine is 15.5mm from the edge of the material to the centre of the hole. Then there is 4 auxiliary stop that can also be used which will give you depending on the one being used. Can give you 32mm from the center of pre done hole to the next pair of holes, 43mm from the edge of the material to the center of the hole, 32mm from the edge of the material to the center of the hole for mitre joints and 9mm from the edge of the material to the center of the hole for narrow material |
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Jan 22, 2015 9:23:39 GMT -5
Post by Knight Woodworks on Jan 22, 2015 9:23:39 GMT -5
Lincoln and WrightWW,
Thanks, I'd seen that vid but somehow missed the auxiliary stops. Special thanks Wright for providing the dimentions.
Re: The OF 2200 - I own one as well and really like it. Wish Festool would redesign the 1010 & 1400 on the same platform.
John
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Jan 22, 2015 23:41:48 GMT -5
Post by 7 on Jan 22, 2015 23:41:48 GMT -5
I have both of the other two festool routers (OF1010 & 1400). I use the 1400 more than the 1010 but really like both of them. I likely should have purchased the 2200 instead of the 1400 base on how much positive feedback I seem to hear from 2200 users. I also want the Domino XL but really don't have an income related need for it so it's hard to justify. Stupid tools.
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R cash
Junior Member
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Post by R cash on Jan 23, 2015 0:53:00 GMT -5
I love the 2200 so much that when a local shop was selling off festool stock I grab a second one at almost 1/2 price. I hate changing set ups a real time burner. Hence the reason for 2 cabinet saws and a Erika and 4 trim routers with 1/8"1/4"3/8"radius bits and 1 chamfer bit ready to roll.  |
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Jan 23, 2015 11:29:10 GMT -5
Post by jalvis on Jan 23, 2015 11:29:10 GMT -5
Nothing worse then changing tooling. If you're in this business long enough you will gather more and more gear. I'm the same way having several routers permanently set up. Another great large router is the old Fein that they no longer make. Wouldn't mind having two or three more.
Also planning on another Table Saw in the future. Would like to have a larger blade and thinking of a 16" unit. Like the Back to Back units like, R Cash. Truth is you will never have enough Tools and tooling.
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Jan 23, 2015 19:01:06 GMT -5
Post by Knight Woodworks on Jan 23, 2015 19:01:06 GMT -5
Yup I too have multiple trimers with different bits. Last shop I worked in had two table saws, a full stroke SCMI slider & a Powermatic 66.
Really nice to have one of each.
Nice shop Mr. Cash.
John
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Jan 23, 2015 19:40:52 GMT -5
Post by MrToolJunkie on Jan 23, 2015 19:40:52 GMT -5
Nothing worse then changing tooling. If you're in this business long enough you will gather more and more gear. I'm the same way having several routers permanently set up. Another great large router is the old Fein that they no longer make. Wouldn't mind having two or three more. Also planning on another Table Saw in the future. Would like to have a larger blade and thinking of a 16" unit. Like the Back to Back units like, R Cash. Truth is you will never have enough Tools and tooling. Is your Felder a 16 inch blade? Now that you have one, do you prefer it to a regular cabinet saw or with the track saw do you like a traditional cabinet saw and track saw for sheets and straight-line ripping? I always wanted a slider, but it is not high on my want/wish list any more due to space constraints and the fact that my tracksaw cuts so well. Curious to hear your thoughts. I toured a shop that had two old Oliver machines back-to-back with 16 inch blades. One set up for ripping and one for cross-cut. This had the cast iron sliding top on it. A great set-up and rock solid. |
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Post by jalvis on Jan 23, 2015 21:31:41 GMT -5
Nothing worse then changing tooling. If you're in this business long enough you will gather more and more gear. I'm the same way having several routers permanently set up. Another great large router is the old Fein that they no longer make. Wouldn't mind having two or three more. Also planning on another Table Saw in the future. Would like to have a larger blade and thinking of a 16" unit. Like the Back to Back units like, R Cash. Truth is you will never have enough Tools and tooling. Is your Felder a 16 inch blade? Now that you have one, do you prefer it to a regular cabinet saw or with the track saw do you like a traditional cabinet saw and track saw for sheets and straight-line ripping? I always wanted a slider, but it is not high on my want/wish list any more due to space constraints and the fact that my tracksaw cuts so well. Curious to hear your thoughts. I toured a shop that had two old Oliver machines back-to-back with 16 inch blades. One set up for ripping and one for cross-cut. This had the cast iron sliding top on it. A great set-up and rock solid. My Felder is a 700 Series with 12" blade. It also has a scoring blade. I prefer a sliding panel saw for most tasks. I find it safer and more efficient if you have the space. I am yet to find a regular cabinet saw with a scoring blade and euro fence. Although after owning just a panel saw for several years I'm ready to add a regular saw to the mix. If I'm in the shop the track saw doesn't get used all that often. The only time I strait line rip with the track saw is over 9 feet since thats the max that my slider can handle. Otherwise full sheets and solid timber end up on the panel saw. The 16" Oliver is the saw that catches my attention. Truth is I will probably keep adding saws as finances allow. Its a hard balance with machinery. I need to upgrade my dust collection in the new shop and a wide belt sander is high on the list. All in time. Tools are all about effeciency. If you have the time or don't have to profit then there are many options. I look long term and flexibility in tasks. I also have a Felder 700 shaper moulder. That thing is an extremely versatile machine as I can use everything from 1/4" router bits to 40mm arbor tooling. It can also stack tooling, tilt the arbor up to 45 degrees, has a sliding table, and with a power feeder is like the swiss army knife of tools. |
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R cash
Junior Member
Posts: 73
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Jan 23, 2015 21:59:42 GMT -5
Post by R cash on Jan 23, 2015 21:59:42 GMT -5
In my shop Ive had a panel saw for more than 15 yrs so a slider has been a dream and A Felder ..... .. ..
Saw one once at a trade show wow. Track saw panel saw table saw slider saw hand saw all in the quiver to do the best you can.
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Jan 23, 2015 23:58:35 GMT -5
Post by MrToolJunkie on Jan 23, 2015 23:58:35 GMT -5
Very cool. I would love to have Martin machinery - the jointer and planer Martin offers is a dream set-up. I just need space for machinery, LOL. I agree that it is an investment in efficiency. I have always liked Felder's shapers with the tilting and quick-change arbor system. That is a really nice set-up that you have, Jarvis.
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Post by jalvis on Jan 24, 2015 14:24:55 GMT -5
Very cool. I would love to have Martin machinery - the jointer and planer Martin offers is a dream set-up. I just need space for machinery, LOL. I agree that it is an investment in efficiency. I have always liked Felder's shapers with the tilting and quick-change arbor system. That is a really nice set-up that you have, Jarvis. Martin is in a class of there own. Serious money for those tools. Felder/hammer offers a good value. Especially there hammer series and the 700 is the best value in the Felder line. One thing to remember with any tool is that there are no magical solutions in the machine alone. Even with good machinery the learning curve is LONG and proper technique is imperative for good results. I'm still learning and struggling at times. Tuning is also very important and requires quite a bit of money to invest in the tools to check everything. The worst part is taking the unpaid time to learn or having a project go longer to try new methods. The amount of money in tools and shop is extreme. You really have to love this profession to swallow the pill. |
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R cash
Junior Member
Posts: 73
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Post by R cash on Jan 26, 2015 23:44:54 GMT -5
"The amount of money in tools and shop is extreme . You really have to love profession to swallow the pill." I started woodworking in 1978 at 14 yrs old. A woodworker I meet then that is still in the same shop today has the same 4"inch jointer radial arm bandsaw artisan tablesaw. His shop might be 750 sqft he makes solid mortise tenon rocking chairs and bar stools and a few other things. Yes it's is easy to say he needs to upgrade and his sys is old but his product is great and he makes a living. My point is any body can make good products with out spending a fortune on the best machines. You need skills an experience that comes with a lot of mistakes then you learn how to avoid them. Then you really appreciate what the best tools do for you and make your work better. I put my shop together over 28 or so years only buying new stationary powermatic shaper jointer tablesaw at the beginning. Almost all the tools in my shop I got used so I could get better machines less than new prices. Although I bought all my mafell new. Mainly the point is the machines don't make you a good at woodworking you make you good at it by doing it and loving it and having fun.  |
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Post by jalvis on Jan 27, 2015 11:56:30 GMT -5
I agree with you 100% R. Cash. Making a good quality product is certainly not determined by the tools(Although some things can't be made without specific tools.) Its even harder unless you specialize like the woodworker you mentioned. From my experience profiting is the separating variable not product. Some don't know what profit is or if they are profiting.
Most shops in my area are generational or have a large chunk of investment capital either from a loan or inherited. Some guys I know of worked full time in a different industry all together and used that income to build a shop. I'm doing it the old fashioned way by purchasing as the business profits.
Even if you don't buy high quality tools it still requires a substantial amount of cash to get started. Its a huge hurtle that takes lots of time(28 years) or lots of money up front. Truth is if my goal was purely monetary I would do something else. Its like any craft based industry. You have to love the craft and thats what keeps you going.
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Jan 27, 2015 21:12:11 GMT -5
Post by MrToolJunkie on Jan 27, 2015 21:12:11 GMT -5
I agree with you 100% R. Cash. Making a good quality product is certainly not determined by the tools(Although some things can't be made without specific tools.) Its even harder unless you specialize like the woodworker you mentioned. From my experience profiting is the separating variable not product. Some don't know what profit is or if they are profiting. Most shops in my area are generational or have a large chunk of investment capital either from a loan or inherited. Some guys I know of worked full time in a different industry all together and used that income to build a shop. I'm doing it the old fashioned way by purchasing as the business profits. Even if you don't buy high quality tools it still requires a substantial amount of cash to get started. Its a huge hurtle that takes lots of time(28 years) or lots of money up front. Truth is if my goal was purely monetary I would do something else. Its like any craft based industry. You have to love the craft and thats what keeps you going. Well said. |
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Feb 11, 2015 20:57:52 GMT -5
Post by dbthomas on Feb 11, 2015 20:57:52 GMT -5
Nice info in this thread guys. I had been sold on the domino XL for a long time. It seems like a really great tool. However the DD40 P seems to offer a lots more possibilities and the fact it handles the 5mm shelf pins makes it a winner for me. Festool’s track system for shelf pins is fine pre-finish but I can’t imagine trying to do that after the fact. Jalvis nicely demonstrates this advantage of the DD40 on his channel. Timothy Wilmots has a nice video putting the XL to work making a shop door. One could always build Matthias Wandel’s Pantorouter or Pantorouter XL  He also has several videos and articles dedicated to joint strength tests which make for interesting reading. woodgears.ca/pantorouter/index.htmlwoodgears.ca/pantorouter/xl.htmlwoodgears.ca/joint_strength/Something else to note, but It is possibly just hearsay, I heard someone mention that biscuit joints can leave visible indentations in in the finished surface when viewed at certain angles meaning it is better to place the joint lower than center to avoid this possibility. I wonder if any of you know if this is also a possibility with dowel or domino joints.. |
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