I do recall seeing a youtube video, last year, where someone was sanding end-grain solid timber butchers blocks (a very demanding sanding task) using a Festool sander that was larger than a Rotex RO150FEQ, with plenty of die-cast alloy in the sander chassis, but I don't know if it is a discontinued product and I don't know if it was just a rotary-grinder type of sander.
I realise the following isn't really Mafell territory but I AM a Mafell customer (MT55cc) and I know there are some experienced and level-headed people on this forum, so I see no harm in asking it, as an aside to my usual Mafell-specific posts.
I currently use a Mirka DEROS (5mm orbit) for general sanding tasks and I love it - it's a brilliant little lightweight sander that is ideal for light duty and decorating tasks (but not for crevice and mouldings sanding, which are better suited to DEOS), and I enthusiastically recommend the DEROS to anyone looking for a finish sander that is easy to use single-handed without undue fatigue (especially for overhead work, for which tasks, it's an absolute game-changer). It's extraction is also superb.
Anyway, I'm looking for recommendations for a much HEAVIER DUTY disc sander, please. Disc size in the range of 150mm-200mm. This sander to be used for miscellaneous property renovation tasks (wall paint removal prior to plastering, small areas of plaster removal, small parquet floors, etc. etc. etc. A wide range of tasks that need reliable power and high stock removal not possible using run-of-the-mill sanders).
I don't want a Festool Rotex RO150FEQ
I don't want a Makita BO6050
I don't want a Bosch GEX 150 AC
I know there are mixed (but mostly positive) reviews for the Rotex machines, but I'm not willing to buy into Festool for a sander, when there are plenty of very decent alternatives, added to which, I'd like something a bit more heavy duty. Not massively so, but a bit. I do recall seeing a youtube video, last year, where someone was sanding end-grain solid timber butchers blocks (a very demanding sanding task) using a Festool sander that was larger than a Rotex RO150FEQ, with plenty of die-cast alloy in the sander chassis, but I don't know if it is a discontinued product and I don't know if it was just a rotary-grinder type of sander.
Like the RO150FEQ, the Makita and Bosch machines are also not quite as heavy-duty as I'm looking for, added to which, I find it difficult to take either of them seriously when they are each rumoured to have issues with their gearboxes, when used under load, on account of incorporating plastic components within their gearboxes
If anyone has any suggestions (and possibly personal experience) of heavy duty disc sanders, I'm keen to hear it, please.
Obviously, high stock removal heavy-duty sanders have a substantial amount of forced rotation.
With that understood, I am not completely ruling-out a pure rotational sander, but I'd ideally prefer to consider sanders that have some degree of randomisation of the stroke, as the disc rotates (which we all know the above 3 sanders do have). It seems some of the heavy-duty rotary disc sanders have an 'eccentric' motion, which I am assuming is a compromise solution to try to avoid rotary swirl marks as much as possible, under load conditions (or high stock removal conditions) that perhaps don't permit random orbital.
Flex offer a few sanders, some of which are pure-rotation ('grinder-style'):
They also offer a ROS (8.8mm orbit), but it doesn't appear to incorporate any forced rotation for high stock-removal, so it seems it would probably just be a beefier incarnation of my DEROS, and thus not what I'm after:
Fein have the MSf 636-1, which they claim is powerful, but 380w (input) doesn't sound especially powerful:
Rupes BR112AES (12mm orbit) doesn't appear to incorporate any forced rotation:
Rupes EK200AS does have forced rotation, but doesn't appear to have any eccentricity (so it appears to be a 'grinder-style' sander):
Can anyone offer any insight, commentary, or education on my options, and/or any other possible machines to consider?
As I said, I haven't totally ruled-out a pure rotary machine, but I know from experience that trying to sand with pure rotation tends to result in very rapid disc-clogging, and leaves very obvious swirl marks on the work material (obviously, going up through the grit grades can mitigate the swirls to some extent. but the point still stands).
Some way down the road, I may invest in a Rokamat GEX (renovation grinder), as well, but for now I'm looking for something approximately the size of an angle grinder, like the Rotex, only heavier duty.
Just come across this thread - I was looking for something along the same lines (although for my purposes a larger head diameter wasn't as important) and opted on the Retecflex, which has performed very well using both sanding discs and scouring masonry renovation head. If I've got larger areas to work through I have a 125mm Hitachi with a diamond grinding disc and dust cowl, all supplied by PWM (worth having a look at if you're UK based). One factor that's not been mentioned and is worth considering is the weight of the tool, especially if working on walls, which you've mentioned. The Festool rav 180 is 4.2 kg, the Metabo WEV 17-125 is 2.5 kg (maybe closer to 3 with dust cowl). The tools I've been looking at recently are the Rokamats, and particularly the Chameleon -https://rokamat.com/en/produkte/grinders/rokamat-chameleon/#zubehoer on the surface of things this seems to answer most of your questions. The one thing I don't understand is the stated rpm of 150-570 and the rated output of 1000W - not sure how that would measure up to some of the heavier duty tasks? But might be worth checking out? Not cheap however.
The tools I've been looking at recently are the Rokamats, and particularly the Chameleon -https://rokamat.com/en/produkte/grinders/rokamat-chameleon/#zubehoer
It does look very versatile, it seems a bit too good to be true - but that may just be me being cynical and/or having no hands on experience with Rokamat tools. There are plenty of youtube videos of it performing a number of everyday renovation tasks, which look promising - I'd want to test drive one though before parting with that sort of money. A company called Alphacut based in the UK stocks them. On the angle grinder front, as a point of comparison with the Metabo WEV 17-125 I'd also have a close look at the Flex LBE 17-11 125, similar spec though rpm from 2800-11500 and a little weightier at 2.6 kg. There are also dedicated cowls for both cutting and sanding/grinding.
Post by huntsgemein on Dec 19, 2020 21:07:20 GMT -5
Standard grinders have standard grinder speeds. Maybe a tad too fast for reno work? Yes, you can slow 'em down using the variable speed. But less speed = less air cooling too. If you're (as I tend to be) rather heavy handed, this puts a lot of heat-load into the armature & field windings.
Dedicated reno grinders usually rotate slower, with reduction gearing, allowing the motor to still spin fast enough for a full dose of cooling air velocity (up to 400 km/hr in Metabo's case!). This ensures long life & minimal chance of burnout.
The other thing I've yet to experiment with is the P1 dust free sanding system by Jost abrasives. This allied with something like the Metabo WEV 17-125 quick inox or the Flex model mentioned above, would definitely be one answer to the 'heavier duty sander' question.
The P1 dust-free sanding for angle grinders system fits on all electronically controlled angle sanders and angle polishers, irrespective of the machine.
From Mr.Jost himself - "The P1 fits on any angle grinder with a spindle M14. But it’s very important that the speed of the machine is adjustable. The max. speed for the P1 is 3600 rpm. If you go faster the danger is too high to burn the lacquer and damage the surface."
I inquired about this system back in 2016, at that point they had no UK distributors/retailers, this thread has rekindled my interest - I've emailed them for an update on UK suppliers or Euro retailers who'd ship to UK/US.
For stripping/prepping large flat areas rapidly and with a good amount of the dust captured, these are certainly worth trying. The issue I have with my Retecflex is the small size of the sanding head, and doubts about how efficient it is at capturing the dust.
abdon: I stand corrected , the angle fence is only attaches with F -Tracks , what confused me was , that the Timberwolf site mentioned it will work with the NFU machine, yes it will work but only I guess when you use the Ftrack , with other tracks Like the KSS L.
Nov 28, 2020 22:52:01 GMT -5
glynnco: Did you order from GereedschapPro? I see them as in stock but I'm located in the US and am not sure if they ship here. I sent them an email asking about shipping but it was returned undeliverable...
Dec 10, 2020 7:37:40 GMT -5
jonathan: I've purchased a lot of stuff from our neighbours @ GereedschapPro.nl As far as I know they are one of the larger Mafell dealers in the EU. I can recommend them, they usually respond quickly.
Dec 11, 2020 13:58:36 GMT -5
NFU 50 Transportation?: Hi Guys, is there some Systainer for the NFU 50?
Dec 11, 2020 14:30:12 GMT -5
frezik24: Hello everyone
Dec 13, 2020 9:20:00 GMT -5
lasse: Thanks for the tip! I have own a mafell rail which is 160 cm and one that is 80 cm. Will it work just as well or will I need to buy rail that is 110 cm?
Mar 18, 2021 15:35:15 GMT -5