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Post by caliban on Aug 23, 2015 12:12:58 GMT -5
Hello,
although i am mainly a festool user, i´ve ordered the P1cc because i have the impression, that it is better than the corresponding competitors jigsaws. I await the P1cc tomorrow, but i missed to order the blade W3 from Mafell, so i searched for information on other blades and found the answer within this forum, thank you! I can use as well the bosch blades, since it seams, they are equal, except this special double blade from Mafell. However, i have to cut some 9cm beams, 3.5 inch, and i think, from the information in this forum, that i can buy the bosch T344D tomorrow from any local dealer hereabout.
Thank you for the information
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Post by Tom Gensmer on Aug 25, 2015 9:44:31 GMT -5
Great to hear! Indeed, the P1cc is not an inexpensive saw, but I've found it to be without peer, I enjoy every opportunity I have to use it. I look forward to hearing your thoughts and experiences with your new saw!
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Hello
Aug 26, 2015 1:04:41 GMT -5
Post by caliban on Aug 26, 2015 1:04:41 GMT -5
Hello Tom, maybe, this saw is expensive, but in term of what i am getting back, it turns out, the expense was worth every penny. The first thing i realized was the build quality and the sturdiness, it is superior to all other jigsaws i´ve had before (bud i must admit, i didnt use the carved). A jigsaw, in my option, has to be heavy (except someone does modeling with small objects). I switch the saw on and it is sounding like a quality saw machine. But when i went out to do my first piece of beam, 3.5 inch (9cm), it was a joy to see and feel, how it cuts threw the material, and then, when i saw the results, even with a no-name-blade from the warehouse, the rectangular cut, i knew, this machine is not too expensive, in fact, it is with every cent, maybe, for the results it is even a bargain... And it will be even better with quality blades from Bosch or Mafell. It is the quality i want, nothing less. I do not regret a second that i´ve bought this saw. (There is one minimal down for me, the case fits only as the lowermost case, it has not the t-loc system like festool. It would be nice, if they would agree on a standard so all tools could be stacked up nicely. But this drawback is not related to the quality of this fine tool. Indeed, i am thinking about my next saw again, i wanted to buy the festool TS55 because it fits nicely within the festool system, maybe the MT55cc comes also in my focus) regards
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Hello
Aug 26, 2015 1:13:43 GMT -5
Post by holmz on Aug 26, 2015 1:13:43 GMT -5
IMO you would be mad not to consider the MT55. It is a better saw and the Bosch rails are better than the FT ones. The jig saw also fits onto those rails.
I like the old style systainers. The new ones will fit on the old ones so when one stats them then the new ones need to be on top.
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Hello
Aug 27, 2015 3:22:03 GMT -5
Post by caliban on Aug 27, 2015 3:22:03 GMT -5
Hello holmz,
But the festool ts55 rebq isn't bad and the ts55 is much less deep, only 12(!) mm distance from the cut. But what is also important to me are the systainers. You can open and close and remove them from the stack with only one hand that is a big easement. Mafell (and for example, Makita) container are cumbersome and you always need two hands and a lot of fiddling around, just to pull one from the stack or put it on and lock it,i find it very annoying.
Apart from that, do you think that Mafell is soo much better? Now I know, Mafell produces highest quality, but if I would stick to Mafell,i would have to break my whole organisation system. I am only a hobby woodworker but in my (rare) spare time i have to use every minute and a fast ramp up is essential that I can do some woodwork in my free time.
Regards Caliban
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Hello
Aug 27, 2015 5:01:16 GMT -5
holmz likes this
Post by jonathan on Aug 27, 2015 5:01:16 GMT -5
If the money isn't the issue, I think it makes more sense to go for the MT55cc. It's just a better quality saw and now you've already got the P1cc it also makes more sense to stick with the Mafell/Bosch rails instead of investing in 2 different rail systems. If the systainer is such a huge problem, just put the Mafell in a T-Loc... The old systainers are compatible with the T-Loc's to a certain extent, as long as the old style systainer is on the bottom you can lock the T-Loc's on top.
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Post by holmz on Aug 27, 2015 6:53:54 GMT -5
Hello holmz, But the festool ts55 rebq isn't bad and the ts55 is much less deep, only 12(!) mm distance from the cut. But what is also important to me are the systainers. You can open and close and remove them from the stack with only one hand that is a big easement. Mafell (and for example, Makita) container are cumbersome and you always need two hands and a lot of fiddling around, just to pull one from the stack or put it on and lock it,i find it very annoying. Apart from that, do you think that Mafell is soo much better? Now I know, Mafell produces highest quality, but if I would stick to Mafell,i would have to break my whole organisation system. I am only a hobby woodworker but in my (rare) spare time i have to use every minute and a fast ramp up is essential that I can do some woodwork in my free time. Regards Caliban I have friends that swear by the Festool, and when I was looking at both they could not understand why I would take the chance on a Mafell when Festool is available. I have not used a FT saw, but I do not doubt that are in the top three... Usually #3 behind Bosch (which is made by Mafell) and the Mafell in #1. So I cannot said that it is better, only that I like mine, and the reviews say that it is better. On FOG they similarly say that the FT is superior... but probably because of the 30 day trail and the warranty. What was the clincher was the rails. They are better (easier to connect) and can be clamped closer to the cut, and the Bosch rails are less $. But I have also not used the FT rails. Mostly because I was scared away from them by forum posts about the saws not cutting square and the rails not connecting straight. I kind of prefer square cuts, and straight cuts as I have enough challenges without additional dramas... I think if one already had FT rails, then it can make sense to stick with it. I actually started with the UVA115e which is awesome. The p1cc jig saw also fits the same rail and it too is awesome. Since the box is only for storage and transport it seems like the saw and the rails should be driving factor. I hate how the T-Loc handle sometime pops off, and it doesn't seem as secure, and I dislike how they change the design all the time. You could buy a T-Loc for it... (and use the classic for clamps and other crap... Or depending on where you are at I would be tempted to swap some T-loc boxes as I prefer the classic, and I just ordered some T-locs for general organization. Joe is a professional, and Lincoln I think is also a professional. You probably would benefit from their input. If the money isn't the issue, I think it makes more sense to go for the MT55cc. It's just a better quality saw and now you've already got the P1cc it also makes more sense to stick with the Mafell/Bosch rails instead of investing in 2 different rail systems. If the systainer is such a huge problem, just put the Mafell in a T-Loc... The old systainers are compatible with the T-Loc's to a certain extent, as long as the old style systainer is on the bottom you can lock the T-Loc's on top. ^This^ And the cost difference doesn't seem so bad when you have the Bosch rails as the rails are less $. Or get the Bosch TS... which is still a step up and unsurprisingly it rides on Bosch rails too. www.bosch-professional.com/gb/en/community/category/bosch-gkt-55-gce-plunge-saw-vs-festool-ts55/389008-t
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Hello
Aug 27, 2015 7:40:35 GMT -5
Post by toomanytoys on Aug 27, 2015 7:40:35 GMT -5
What is the most important thing for you? Dealing with storage boxes at the start and end of your work, or assembling a project with straight, square cuts with a good cut finish that you don't have to spend time correcting. I'm buying for the tool first.
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Hello
Aug 28, 2015 2:03:52 GMT -5
Post by caliban on Aug 28, 2015 2:03:52 GMT -5
Come on, I don't want quarrels, but are you really trying to say that you can't make a strait and square cut with the festool ts55?? I've seen too many work produced with the festool that I would believe that. After the experience with the P1cc, and, before, through my own searching, i knew that the P1cc would be superior. From my conclusion, i would also follow you, when you are claiming that the Mafell maybe it's better than the festool saw. But the claim that you can't cut strait worth festool is, in my eyes, a little bit weird.
Ok, maybe I could use the t-loc systainers to carry the Mafell MT55cc, then I should try to combine the festool and the Mafell world, since I then would have the domino 500, the OF1010 and the rail from festool, on the other side I would have the P1cc and then the MT55cc and a rail from Mafell, a very eclectic range of tools...
One word about the price: when it comes to tools, an offset of some hundreds € is, in my opinion, not "expensive". About 30 years ago for example, i bought a toolset from Gedore, it was very "expensive", but I still use these tools today without any drawback. If I devide the extra costs through the used time, I spend only some cent more a month, but I have a much higher quality than with the average tools. In these terms, it is really not a matter of costs, but a question of using those tools.
But anyway, thank you for your comments, I appreciate that very much!
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Hello
Aug 28, 2015 4:42:56 GMT -5
Post by jonathan on Aug 28, 2015 4:42:56 GMT -5
Nobody's saying the TS55 is bad. I just think there's no added value to the TS55 over the MT55. It only makes sense if a user is already entrenched in the Festool eco-system with rails and the plug-it cords and in your case the style of carrying cases. And even then you can ask yourself the question what's most important to you?
Either saw is more than adequate to break down sheet goods and then some.
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Hello
Aug 28, 2015 6:45:59 GMT -5
Post by holmz on Aug 28, 2015 6:45:59 GMT -5
Come on, I don't want quarrels, but are you really trying to say that you can't make a strait and square cut with the festool ts55?? I've seen too many work produced with the festool that I would believe that. After the experience with the P1cc, and, before, through my own searching, i knew that the P1cc would be superior. From my conclusion, i would also follow you, when you are claiming that the Mafell maybe it's better than the festool saw. But the claim that you can't cut strait worth festool is, in my eyes, a little bit weird. Ok, maybe I could use the t-loc systainers to carry the Mafell MT55cc, then I should try to combine the festool and the Mafell world, since I then would have the domino 500, the OF1010 and the rail from festool, on the other side I would have the P1cc and then the MT55cc and a rail from Mafell, a very eclectic range of tools... One word about the price: when it comes to tools, an offset of some hundreds € is, in my opinion, not "expensive". About 30 years ago for example, i bought a toolset from Gedore, it was very "expensive", but I still use these tools today without any drawback. If I devide the extra costs through the used time, I spend only some cent more a month, but I have a much higher quality than with the average tools. In these terms, it is really not a matter of costs, but a question of using those tools. But anyway, thank you for your comments, I appreciate that very much! I don't think any one is tryng to start a quarrel, but most seem passionate which can come across as such. The FT saw had some change (of their many) where the stop for zero degrees was removed or something like that. I do not know, I only know that people complain about having to "calibrate it for a square cut". Then there is the rails, which need a straight edge to make connecting them work. The Bosch rails are bone head proof (which I have proven) I have 2 rails (the third being cut for the MFT). Last Tuesday was doing a few cuts used it as a 1600, and 3200-mm a few times to rip some jarrah to 50-mm wide (x16mm thick). Unless you have a long and a short FT rail, then one could easily put the rails toegther and take them apart many times in a couple of hours. Having it easy and repeatable makes sense. I is also easier to transport 2 1600-mm rails then a 3 meter rail. I do not believe that Festool invented the systainer, in the same way that the festool Forstner bits are make by Jobo in Switzerland, the Systainers are made by Tanos. They (Tanos) also sell the systainers to Mafell. So while it looks like a Mafell is in a FT systainer, if one was rasied on Mafell first then the FT would appear to be in a Mafell systainer. I ended up getting one of the last Mafell LO50 8-mm routers, so if you already have a OF1010 then maybe there is some extra chin scratching. I have a Domino and an MFT with the Bosch rail on it. I suppose it is somewhat eclectic, but it works. I have as of yet to find a bad Mafell tool, but they do not do 14 sanders and tons of other stuff. I dunno... there are many good options, so unless you have FT rails, then I would suggest Mafell or Bosch. I am more of a DIYer, so it is ease of use and the joy it gives me. It is a hobby, which the tools facilitate getting joy from. The only real difficulty is if one is already buried to the hip bones with FT, and has a stack of their rails. Then the TS55 makes sense. If one is starting from scratch, it seems pretty obvious to me to go Mafell or Bosch. But everyone is different.
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Hello
Aug 28, 2015 16:57:58 GMT -5
Post by lincoln on Aug 28, 2015 16:57:58 GMT -5
Hello Caliban, welcome to the MUF. I got seven good years out of my TS55, using it on site and in the workshop, before updating to the MT55. While I was happy with the saw, the tracks were a constant source of frustration. Joining them was a nightmare, so I bought a 2700, which was a pain to transport. I sold it and imported a MT55 - was very surprised at how much better the saw is. More power, smoother operation, better dust collection, easier blade changing, scribing function, better accessories, dead easy track joining. Having two types of track isn't that big a deal - I have the Mafell for my saw, and a couple of Festool for my 1400 router. I'm not sold on the whole 'system' thing, prefer to buy the best tool for the job. My TS55 was the older version (EBQ?), not the newer (RBQ?). Lincoln.
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Post by GhostFist on Aug 28, 2015 19:26:21 GMT -5
Festool-readily available quality tracks awesome. Advantage festool
Mafell not as readily available.
Mafell track system. simple and precise. Festool track system - more finicky Advantage Mafell
Some nicer features on the Mafell and a rugged build quality. Advantage Mafell, but it's subjective.
Conclusion. both a high quality product worthy of their price tags. There are no wrong choices.
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Hello
Aug 29, 2015 0:13:45 GMT -5
Post by jm on Aug 29, 2015 0:13:45 GMT -5
How often are you guys buying tracks? I sold my Festool saw for the Makita a few months back. The scoring function on paper isn't as ingenious as the Mafell (it doesn't do the 0.1mm inboard offset), but I'm still making razor sharp cuts. I need to do the cheap melamine test that someone did (JAlvis maybe?). The tipover prevention is a nice bonus. The Makita rails feel sturdier than the Festool as well, and the anti-splinter strip doesn't move around like my Festool did. The extra watts are much appreciated as well. It's a better saw overall in my opinion, despite being a couple hundred bucks less. If I needed another one tomorrow, I wouldn't even consider the Festool anymore having owned the Makita. Still might spring for the Mafell someday though...
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Hello
Aug 29, 2015 10:55:41 GMT -5
via mobile
Post by GhostFist on Aug 29, 2015 10:55:41 GMT -5
Just goes to show you how people's preferences can differ. I've used the makita quite a bit and hated it, glad it's satisfying you though. they all just cut wood in the end.
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