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Post by Red on Feb 3, 2016 13:42:45 GMT -5
This is exactly what you get when modifying electrical devices without consulting with an expert. This guy has a US version, that guy has a UK version and, in this post over here, we've got a guy who imported his from Germany.
Seriously, does anyone here really think that people with careers in the electrical field learned electrical theory on the internet?
Does my user name only appear on my computer? I mean...I even started this thread!
DO NOT MODIFY ELECTRICAL DEVICES WITHOUT CONSULTING WITH AN ELECTRICAL EXPERT!
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Post by holmz on Feb 3, 2016 15:00:53 GMT -5
Please explain
Is it US 220 with push/pull to go into a 230v euro saw? or Is it a 120v US saw?
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Post by toomanytoys on Feb 3, 2016 15:16:46 GMT -5
Actually I thought he handled the situation quite well. Hemdale realized he made the mistake of not writing down or taking a picture of the original wire location and came on the site asking if anyone with the same unit and same wires could show him the proper connection. Another member also told him to wait until someone with the same unit would respond. And that is what happened, just what a community should do. Going on Google would not have helped him, only showing wire color coding, but not how this tool was laid out. Red, the Internet blew the cork out of the electrical bottle a long time ago. For the last 20 years I've been on audio forums where we've discussed building amps, DACs, etc., as well as building power cords for all the electrical components. Well respected electronic engineers like John Curl and Bob Crump of Parasound fame have been participating all this time along with others. In fact the "Bob Crump power cord" is something that thousands of people like me have constructed, along with thousands of other variations. There are sub forums on sites that are dedicated to building power cords, like the Cable Asylum within Audio Asylum for just one. www.audioasylum.com/cgi/tv.mpl?forum=cables
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Post by holmz on Feb 3, 2016 15:20:10 GMT -5
That all said, in a doubleninsulated tool what are the implications of switching the return rather than the active? And what does it mean when there are 2x active leads coming in?
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Post by Red on Feb 3, 2016 15:41:01 GMT -5
Actually I thought he handled the situation quite well. Hemdale realized he made the mistake of not writing down or taking a picture of the original wire location and came on the site asking if anyone with the same unit and same wires could show him the proper connection. Another member also told him to wait until someone with the same unit would respond. And that is what happened, just what a community should do. Going on Google would not have helped him, only showing wire color coding, but not how this tool was laid out. Red, the Internet blew the cork out of the electrical bottle a long time ago. For the last 20 years I've been on audio forums where we've discussed building amps, DACs, etc., as well as building power cords for all the electrical components. Well respected electronic engineers like John Curl and Bob Crump of Parasound fame have been participating all this time along with others. In fact the "Bob Crump power cord" is something that thousands of people like me have constructed, along with thousands of other variations. There are sub forums on sites that are dedicated to building power cords, like the Cable Asylum within Audio Asylum for just one. www.audioasylum.com/cgi/tv.mpl?forum=cables I have no idea who these people are, but did John Curl and Bob Crump learn their electrical theory on the internet? Perhaps John and Bob have never been sued because a hungry lawyer told someone it would be a great idea.
By the way, I have always made it perfectly clear that the personal message (PM) utility is open to all MUF members...so no one is actually trying to put a "cork" into any bottle, are they? As someone who has seen the results of poor electrically-related decisions -- by highly-trained electrical technicians -- I have to assume that someone without the same training can end up the same way.
Sorry, this isn't something that can simply be laughed off with a hyperlink -- this is a safety issue...and, by the way, one of the "electrical technicians" I mentioned was cooked because of a faulty power cord!
Use the PM function -- it's there for a reason.
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Post by GhostFist on Feb 3, 2016 16:19:36 GMT -5
It's assumed here that when you take apart your expensive tool that you run the risk of it not going together properly. It's assumed that you should have a good understanding of the risks involved. Just as certain methods of carpentry and construction are risky to yourself, client, or the project. That being said we all make mistakes and hopefully learn from them. The whole idea of a public forum is so that questions or a general discussion can be asked to a community of common interest. While we all play nice for the most part, one cannot guarantee the credentials or skill level of our fellow members based on the comments or photos they post online. I'll say this,no one on here is an absolute authority on anything, at least not sanctioned by the all powerful governing body of this website (our 3 admins, yours truly included)so take that into consideration when seeking advice from the membership.
That being said, the whole purpose of this forum is to ask questions and gain some user approved knowledge to the tools they use. Many people have performed modifications to the cords on their tools and have claimed success with these modifications. It stands to reason that someone having trouble performing one of these mods, as risky as they might be, would ask this forum's membership for advice.
I would ask that we treat each other with respect on this site in order to maintain the healthy community we enjoy. If there is a problem with the advice given, you're free to voice your opinion but it MUST be respectful.
The whole site has minimal policing, in case you haven't noticed, as I'm a bit of an anarchist of sorts I suppose. I don't want to frame how conversations evolve or devolve but instead let nature take it's course. If it ever comes to the point where we turn into a childish bickering fest, and we all start typing only in capslock, I'll simply shut the forum down. No one needs that headache.
To recap, be sure of what your doing and the risks involved. Ask questions. Be civil. Seek additional resources if you're still unsure, such as an outside expert. If you have a differing opinion, offer it, but be nice. If you state your concerns clearly, than that's all you can do on a text based forum.
The last thing I want to here is anyone getting hurt because of advice given on this site, however, use your adult judgement before you do stuff you're not sure of.
Respect to all, Stay healthy, Don't blow up, Play nice, Long Live the MUF
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Post by holmz on Feb 4, 2016 3:42:41 GMT -5
Another idea is to ensure that the breaker is on an RCD GFI breaker. Then if it all goes pear shaped it is only pear shaped for a short time. You can get GFI/RCD power strips.
I have no idea is there are US 220v versions though. Nor do I know what it exactly means with supply and neutral when both are doing 1/2 of a push-pull function.
Our old alloy body craftsman drill circa 1960's was good example of one that could be a danger with the case tied rather than "double insulted".
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Post by charley1968 on Feb 4, 2016 5:05:29 GMT -5
Hemdale, i risk stating the bleeding obvious: could you take your saw to a Mafell repair service and have it fixed there?
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kdjb
New Member
Posts: 23
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Post by kdjb on Feb 4, 2016 15:24:37 GMT -5
The last thing I want to here is anyone getting hurt because of advice given on this site, however, use your adult judgement before you do stuff you're not sure of. "Adult Judgement" May stand true for dangers you can see in front of you a spinning saw blade, Working at heights etc etc I could carry on all day with electricit y this is not the case what appears to be a great modification could so easily go wrong and you just wouldn't know potentially until it's too late because you can't physically see the danger!
All i see from Reds Post is him showing concern ...
(This is not aimed at any individual) If you don't know what you're doing put your ego aside and either ask for help or just pay someone who does know what they're doing to do your modifications for you because your health/life is worth more than a Plug-it/Neutrik Kb
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mattuk
Junior Member
Posts: 79
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Post by mattuk on Feb 4, 2016 15:47:33 GMT -5
My apologies for joining this thread late.
Dear Admins, I have been helped by Red on a couple of points regarding sleeving and cables, TF projects and other stuff. I have also benefited from knowledge shown by several others here. In conversations with Red it has become apparent that he has witnessed people who have come to harm through meeting electricity in an unplanned manner. His willingness to help with electrical issues is fuelled by a desire to see no one else hurt in such a manner. I hope that his passion, when solely expressed through a keyboard, does not become misunderstood. Cheers Matt
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Post by GhostFist on Feb 4, 2016 16:10:56 GMT -5
I don't recall pointing the finger at anyone. Electricity is dangerous, we should all know that. Again, if you don't know or aren't sure about what you're doing, my advice is not to do it. A sentiment shared by, I'm sure, everyone here.
All I ask is that we remain respectful of both safety and each other.
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Post by holmz on Feb 5, 2016 0:34:20 GMT -5
Well we removed the electrical section.... Probably for risk mitigation.
It is hard to dance around that the mod is possible and easy. And hard to provide useful information without exposing one's self to risk.
It is the nature of he legal beast. One either hintz around it, or provide info, or use PM, or some other mechanism.
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Post by Red on Feb 5, 2016 7:13:16 GMT -5
Well we removed the electrical section.... Probably for risk mitigation. It is hard to dance around that the mod is possible and easy. And hard to provide useful information without exposing one's self to risk. It is the nature of he legal beast. One either hintz around it, or provide info, or use PM, or some other mechanism. Hey, I'd be the first to tell you that sitting in a PME lab for all those years -- in a tightly controlled-environment (70F and 35% humidity year round) -- was one of the easiest jobs in the world, but it was made easy because I spent many hours in a DOD technical school and, later, even more hours in college classrooms.
There's simply no way around the facts...becoming complacent with electrical circuitry -- be it a circuit board or a simple wire/lead that feeds it -- can (and does) kill people.
KDJB is right on the money. Electricity is a silent, invisible killer -- which is exactly why I employed the word "complacent" in the second paragraph. It all seems harmless and "easy" until that one ill-advised shortcut is taken -- and then it may be too late.
That being said, I'll repeat what I've written many times in the past. If you need electrical advice, please feel free to use the PM function to contact me. If that doesn't work for you, please seek advice from someone trained in the electrical field before exposing yourself to potentially lethal conditions. And, as ever, stay safe...
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Post by hemdale on Feb 11, 2016 11:31:11 GMT -5
During my brief reprieve from my vertigo (only had to grab onto something once while taking the pic). And correct four mistyped words ...... Hi guys, Looking at toomanytoys' picture, it's now obvious that I've put the wires in the wrong direction. toomanytoys: can you please confirm that the picture you've taken of your P1CC has not been taken apart and has the original Mafell cord ? If yes, I'll switch the blue and brown the other way around. On a separate note, I'll wait for Red to PM me if he has any news. Thanks for you help guys.
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Post by Red on Feb 11, 2016 16:10:22 GMT -5
Please check your email, Hemdale.
Be Safe, Red
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