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Post by matchesder on Sept 13, 2020 15:46:24 GMT -5
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Post by aas on Sept 13, 2020 18:03:28 GMT -5
Interesting post, thanks. Found this too - not related but strange set up for doing ends/corners www.c-hessler.de/shop/kantenfraese-universal-mz-100-90f/Reminds me of the Hebor P72 - had a plunge bar for doing the corners. Tried getting hold of one at one point to no avail. Swiss made if I remember correctly. |
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Post by matchesder on Sept 14, 2020 4:25:00 GMT -5
Also interesting. All the bases seem to be build from machined parts from a solid block and profiles. Presumably it’s a very small production volume.
Also interesting router bits.
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Post by alvychippy on Sept 20, 2020 6:45:03 GMT -5
EVERYTHING is down to manufacture and design, right?
unfortunately its the businessman (or women or business persons), not engineers that end up selling us tools, they are the one's that decide what livery, what patent, what components are in that tool and to keep up with it for a normal tool user is nightmare.
For the record, I known of- "loved" Virutex brand ever since learning that about 20 years ago new Makita planer (absolutely most popular tool for carpenters in UK) ~£150 is a including colour 99% (licenced) copy of Virutex, that wasn't available in UK in 110v, but 230v was priced ~£320...
Few other tools- designs were great too, like their sanders at the time were stunning and their routers are great still, that being always under-dog supporter I always consider before purchasing any tool, same as Mafell or as I used to lust for FESTO gear, before they become FesTool- part of TTI.
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Post by matchesder on Sept 22, 2020 5:18:30 GMT -5
Not part of TTI. That is a different story.
Festool is Part of ttS Tool technic systems.
As I understand TTS more or less came from festool tooltechnic itself.
But I can’t say for sure.
Festool was created to separate from festo pneumatic parts.
I read it was even considered ditching the woodworking tools. But a separate brand was created instead.
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Post by alvychippy on Sept 22, 2020 8:25:07 GMT -5
Not part of TTI. That is a different story. Festool is Part of ttS Tool technic systems. As I understand TTS more or less came from festool tooltechnic itself. But I can’t say for sure. Festool was created to separate from festo pneumatic parts. I read it was even considered ditching the woodworking tools. But a separate brand was created instead. hmhmhmhm, perhaps devil is the detail then still, the point of who makes what and how what is labeled is bit of minefield (at least for me)   |
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Post by matchesder on Sept 23, 2020 6:43:49 GMT -5
Absolutely.
Im interested in who makes what for who.
It does not really matter for the tool itself.
But sometimes it helps understanding certain things.
Sometimes it is just nice to know.
The router you showed (or one of its predecessors/successors) was also sold as Mafell LO50 with minor modifications.
In turn the OF2000 was made by Mafell.
When Festool bought Narex, they introduced Protool but changed that soon to also be festool because the quality was equally high.
Sometimes a change of a brand name is just that. No change in quality implied.
On the other hand, sometimes a brand name is kept but the products are changed dramatically.
Like AEG. Which was a top German brand and changed to made in China or whatever under TTI (this time really TTI). While a lot of development for Milwaukee is done in Germany where aeg was located. But I think the production is in China.
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Post by huntsgemein on Sept 23, 2020 7:33:59 GMT -5
It's sad what happened to AEG. Once makers of fine power tools, industrial motors & turbines, consumer electronics, household appliances etc. When the company was split up & the various divisions were sold off, Atlas Copco of Sweden purchased the power tools division.
They in turn contracted out a specialised German design firm to produce an innovative range of ergonomic tools. Some of these were fantastic: the T-Tec 201, Ergomax & RX series Drills, big powerful electronically torque regulated industrial & Core Drills, big SDS Max Combi-hammers, wide 4"/102 mm Planers, electronically speed regulated Mini-Grinders etc. All quite lovely to hold & use, especially in comparison to their German contemporaries at the time.
The company quite deservedly won quite a swag of IF Industrial design awards as a consequence. Coincidentally, so did Metabo at the time ...for an innovative but ultimately useless Cordless Sander!
In one area in particular they were never really up to par was with development in the 80s & 90s of cordless tools. In the same manner as Metabo at the time, both companies missed the boat on cordless development, relying too heavily on their tried & true mains powered tool range.
They were also one of the first (I believe that the Black & Decker Industrial & Elu ranges were actually first from their Italian Felisatti factory) to introduce & popularise the "Plug-It" type modular power cord system, with an extensive range of available lengths up to 10 Metres, but restricted to only one or two models & only in Atlas Copco & early Milwaukee branded versions. Never AEG itself. Even at the time, Atlas Copco were pitching AEG as the lesser of their collective tool brands.
When Atlas Copco eventually sold out to TTI, it all unfortunately rather quickly turned into schaisse. How far the mighty have fallen! Those orange tools (branded as Ridgid in North America) are little better than rubbish.
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Post by aas on Oct 2, 2020 14:33:29 GMT -5
The KF1000 arrived during the week. It is supplied in two small cardboard boxes, one for the motor, one for the base. The main motor body is identical to the DD40P - 1000w, lots of power and very smooth. The KF has variable speed with the black cover for the cable entry housing the speed controller - this black cover is held in by one screw next to the cable entry, it does not feel very sturdy - I'd knock off a few quality points for this! The speed controller lights up blue, and this changes to red when starting, changing speed or under too much load. Height adjustment is very simple and precise, and it locks in place with a lever. The dust collection is very good, the shroud can be moved and then locked into position. Despite the Mafell website and all publicity shots showing a handle on the base, my has been supplied without - the dealer in Germany has told me that all three he has sold are sold minus handle. There is no accessory listed for this, and the online parts viewer is showing blank pages. I've emailed Mafell and am awaiting a reply. The manual shows the accessory peg for trimming the ends of panels as fitting into the base of the handle - it doesn't work without as it is too loose. The base needs the handle for keeping the tool upright... I'll report back once a get a reply from Mafell. Either way, sending a machine out with a missing part, or selling a machine without an important part of the kit is not really on. Now Mafell are controlling prices, there are no deals to be had, this is 449€ plus tax - at this point in time it's hard to justify the price, maybe once the handle issue is cleared up and with a bit more use I will see this differently. In the meantime, I'm very glad to have the Festool MFK700. Mafell sent me the handle that should have been supplied - hats off to them for good customer service and sorting this out quickly. Up at 2000m of altitude for the time being, so not been down to the workshop to try it for a few weeks! |
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Post by holmz on Oct 2, 2020 15:58:22 GMT -5
Absolutely. Im interested in who makes what for who. It does not really matter for the tool itself. But sometimes it helps understanding certain things. Sometimes it is just nice to know. The router you showed (or one of its predecessors/successors) was also sold as Mafell LO50 with minor modifications. ... So who made the LO50? And what other brand was the sold asl? |
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Post by alvychippy on Oct 3, 2020 3:34:13 GMT -5
Absolutely. Im interested in who makes what for who. It does not really matter for the tool itself. But sometimes it helps understanding certain things. Sometimes it is just nice to know. The router you showed (or one of its predecessors/successors) was also sold as Mafell LO50 with minor modifications. ... So who made the LO50? And what other brand was the sold asl? I (we) believe my LO50 is made by Festo, older LO65 (2000w) and Festo 2000 was made by Mafell |
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Post by holmz on Oct 3, 2020 17:35:06 GMT -5
So the LO50 is a FT1010?
(I like mine LO50)
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Post by alvychippy on Oct 4, 2020 6:22:32 GMT -5
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Post by aas on Feb 12, 2021 13:49:32 GMT -5
I've got the confirmation that the KF1000 is an FM milling motor in a Virutex base. Downside - Virutex at Mafell prices; upside - collets available in all main milling sizes so gives a few more options (no I won't bother, I'll stick with 8mm!)
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Post by matchesder on Feb 14, 2021 3:47:26 GMT -5
Since the LO50 base lacks the oval dust extraction port, they are obviously not exactly the same machine. I prefer the plastic adapter on Mafell over the oval port on Festool. |
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