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Post by jm on Jan 31, 2019 4:03:00 GMT -5
12v stuff has been a lost art for most mfgs.
I've been slowly importing Bosch 12v stuff because they seem to be the last mfg that cares to develop the 12v platforms. In the US, Bosch will rebrand a few of their tools into their Dremel brand, but intentionally use a slightly different battery interface (can be modified but a hacky solution), so I end up importing from Germany. Bosch is always among the slowest in battery tech though.
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Post by thehandyman on Jan 31, 2019 11:10:45 GMT -5
12v stuff has been a lost art for most mfgs. I've been slowly importing Bosch 12v stuff because they seem to be the last mfg that cares to develop the 12v platforms. In the US, Bosch will rebrand a few of their tools into their Dremel brand, but intentionally use a slightly different battery interface (can be modified but a hacky solution), so I end up importing from Germany. Bosch is always among the slowest in battery tech though. Bosch NA is definitely getting better at NA now. More new 12v coming this year. The new 12v brushless router and planer are really nice tools too!
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Post by brianpuccio on Jan 31, 2019 19:26:01 GMT -5
2019, new LiHD battery tools coming out from Metabo. - Battery powered compressor. - Battery powered vacuum. - New compact drill. I'm invested in the battery platform, and have been waiting a long time for these 2 but I always end up dissapointed. It's always not quite a finished product from Metabo. For example the systainer vacuum. Why is it not dual battery for more power? and WHY ON EARTH DOES IT NOT CONNECT with other metaloc boxes or systainers?? Now this compressor, why on earth is it not silent, but AGAIN one of those deafening 80-90-100 decibel tools... Anyway, have a look at the video. Some nice new things coming to market. I’m with you, I was hoping the compressor would be on the quiet side. But thanks for the video and insight into what’s coming to those of us in the Metabo/Mafell battery ecosystem. They briefly show a couple of CAS (Cordless Alliance System) tools - I've got the Rothenberger compact plumbing press, great tool - also show the Steinel cordless glue and heat guns... no info on the Steinel site yet, but will be interesting to see pricing. I agree with you Jonathan, a lot of Metabo stuff is not as refined or finished as it should be. Is the new vac mains too like the Makita?.. failing that, it would be nice if a mains adaptor came out to power these 2x tools!.. keep dreaming I guess! Ever since Steinel mentioned they’d be in the battery club, I’ve been waiting for a cordless glue gun (the cord is always so stiff on the corded one I have). No real use for an 18v heat gun, except maybe heat shrinking something outside without having to run an extension cord, but it probably eats batteries like crazy. Just glad choices are showing up because several battery systems for a hobbyist with very limited space is not ideal. 12v stuff has been a lost art for most mfgs. I've been slowly importing Bosch 12v stuff because they seem to be the last mfg that cares to develop the 12v platforms. In the US, Bosch will rebrand a few of their tools into their Dremel brand, but intentionally use a slightly different battery interface (can be modified but a hacky solution), so I end up importing from Germany. Bosch is always among the slowest in battery tech though. Bosch NA is definitely getting better at NA now. More new 12v coming this year. The new 12v brushless router and planer are really nice tools too! What other new 12v Bosch stuff is coming? I’ve got their tiny drill, tiny driver, a few LEDs (older model) and imported the GUS.
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Post by brianpuccio on Sept 25, 2019 19:54:25 GMT -5
They briefly show a couple of CAS (Cordless Alliance System) tools - I've got the Rothenberger compact plumbing press, great tool - also show the Steinel cordless glue and heat guns... no info on the Steinel site yet, but will be interesting to see pricing. I agree with you Jonathan, a lot of Metabo stuff is not as refined or finished as it should be. Is the new vac mains too like the Makita?.. failing that, it would be nice if a mains adaptor came out to power these 2x tools!.. keep dreaming I guess! There's a mention of the 18v Steinel heat gun (not glue gun) in this video: Maybe the glue gun is not far behind?
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Post by huntsgemein on Sept 27, 2019 19:51:23 GMT -5
Sorry to burst your bubble here lads, but there's no such thing as 12v tools any more. It's just lies, bullshit and marketing misinformation.
Since the demise some 5 years ago of the basic 1.2v NiCad & NiMH cells used in lesser-quality pwr tools the market has all but universally switched to Li Ion cells for rechargeable cordless tools. In 3.6v increments. Without exception.
Thus, your Lithium cell powered cordless tools, either in series or parallel configurations, will be available in the following increments ONLY & EXCLUSIVELY: 3.6, 7.2, 14.4, 18, 21.6, etc. up to a max of 36.0v. Some dodgy manufacturers will sometimes claim higher voltages which may actually be available for transitory moments (only when the cells are brand new and fully charged), but the universal standard adopted by HONEST manufacturers worldwide is for AVERAGE peak voltage available.
I'd suggest that any alternative claims to the contrary should be regarded with deep suspicion. Any mnf'r willing to lie & deceive about the small stuff may very well lie about the important suff as well. As a customer, I have a pretty finely tuned BS radar, avoiding misleading & deceptive manufacturers' claims (& their dodgy products) wherever possible.
Having said all that, I can confirm that Metabo/Hitachi's new "12v" EC cordless drill & rattler are indeed more powerful than their 10.8v predecessors, despite having superficially similar battery cell output characteristics. In actual fact, the newer cordless tools have more powerful (& economical) charge/discharge cycles. The "BL" models have EC motors, and both 4.0 AH LiHD and standard 2.0 AH Lithium batteries. The former allow greater peak power discharge than standard cells are able to provide.
Whilst I have both 12 & 10.8v Metabo drills & rattlers I cannot fairly compare & contrast the two equivalent pairs however. The 12v drills' peak speeds are faster, making them marginally more useful, plus greater peak torque output also, making it a bit more versatile too (bigger hole capacity), & the EC motor's efficiency gives it pretty equivalent runtime (charge life) to the 5.2 AH equipped 10.8v older tool.
Likewise the rattlers are similar but different too, with similar characteristics to the drills. In regard to the comparable pairs of mini recipro saws I'm unable to comment definitively as I only have the 10.8v model, but any advantage of this small format saw (principally versatility in fitting both recipro & jigsaw blade shanks) is lost with a frustratingly slow action due to a pretty short (12mm??) stroke length. I note the newer SSE 12 BL actually has a much longer stroke length (16mm) than either the older 10.8v or even the newest 18.0V versions too. This I assume makes it the definitive tool in Metabo's current family of mini-recipros.
The "12v" tools are much larger but are of similar overall weight to their (5.2 AH battery equipped) smaller counterparts. Physically much more like Metabo's full-sized (but compact) L or LT BL range of 18v drills. Unless one has a specific need for smaller & less powerful tools than the superb Metabo BS 18 LTX-3 BL Q or equivalents I honestly don't know why you'd bother with them personally. But for the careful installation of delicate and/or expensive electrical, architectural or plumbing fixtures the more "gutless" nature of the less powerful & brutal "12v" tools may very well be just the ticket.
The 12v line is no longer as "pocketable" as the 10.8v line was either. You instead merely need to hang them off one's toolbelt or pocket in a similar manner to conventional 18v equivalents.
Are they better than the 10.8v line? Well... maybe. The extra speed is appreciated. The larger format is not. The versatile right angle and offset chuck attachments are interchangeable across 10.8, 12 & 18V (L & LT Quick) ranges too. I suspect that the newer SSE 12 BL recipro would be usefully faster than the frustratingly slow 10.8v version. Yet there's much more overall versatility in big M's 18v range, not to mention the entire Cordless Alliance's range/s! Plus that "one battery/charger to rule them all" interchangeability.
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Post by brianpuccio on Apr 23, 2020 17:00:52 GMT -5
They briefly show a couple of CAS (Cordless Alliance System) tools - I've got the Rothenberger compact plumbing press, great tool - also show the Steinel cordless glue and heat guns... no info on the Steinel site yet, but will be interesting to see pricing. I agree with you Jonathan, a lot of Metabo stuff is not as refined or finished as it should be. Is the new vac mains too like the Makita?.. failing that, it would be nice if a mains adaptor came out to power these 2x tools!.. keep dreaming I guess! Metabo has a heat gun, first sighting in this YouTube video: Still no updates from Steinel on heat or glue guns.
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